Yes, Another Post About Atheism

Posted by on September 28, 2012 in Featured, Thoughts | 120 comments

“Atheism” is a term that ought not exist. It is the state which we are all born into, and would stay in if it weren’t for the constant insistence by our cultures and religions that god does in fact exist. A “the world’s most famous Atheist” Professor Richard Dawkins says in his bestselling book The God Delusion, “A child is not a Christian child, not a Muslim child, but a child of Christian parents or a child of Muslim parents.” The same could be said of a Hindu child, or a Buddhist child; A child is brought into the world not with a belief in a particular god or gods, but with an absence of belief. There is one simple reason why this is true, and that comes down to the definition of the word “atheist”, as boring and as hackneyed as that is. This is a point that atheists tirelessly have to reiterate again and again, as it seems to be very poorly understood.

According to the the dictionary, “atheism” is defined as:

1. the doctrine or belief that there is no God.

2. disbelief in the existence of a supreme being or beings.

There is no act of the denial of a god, nor an act of rebellion against a god. No anger, no hatred, no resentment. There simply is no “belief in” any god or gods. It’s the answer to the question of “Do you believe in god or gods?” The answer to which is “No.” It’s as simple as that. Many claim that atheists are “angry at God”, or were “hurt by God”, and while it’s true many people may be angry or hurt, it certainly is not blamed upon a being or deity for which we see no plausible proof or evidence. I can assure you there are also many Christians, Muslims and Hindus who are angry and hurt in the world, but they are the only ones who could blame this on their god or gods, or in some cases, on Satan. For an atheist, this is simply not part of the equation. “A” means “without”, and “theist” means “belief in god or gods”; “Without belief in god or gods.”

For fear of treading over the worn old “atheism vs agnosticism” debate for too long, I will only mention agnosticism in passing. Agnosticism is the answer to a different question. The question is “Can you know for 100% certain that God does or doesn’t exist?” The answer should be, for every right-minded reasonable person “No, I cannot prove or disprove the existence of God”. This means that every person, when asked this question should answer as an agnostic. In this case “a” means without, and “gnostic” means “knowledge” ; “Without knowledge of the conclusive proof of the existence of a god or gods”. It’s an unanswerable and unknowable question, but this is not the same question as the one atheism answers. So many theists see this as a “checkmate” moment against atheists, as we see time and time again in the case of the Richard Dawkins “7 point scale of belief”. (1 = absolute certainty of the existence of a god, and 7 being absolutely certain there is no god.) [3]

So according to the idea that all children are born atheist (not believing in god or gods), all children are likewise born agnostic (without knowledge of god or gods). In a complete vacuum, without any outside input to the belief in a deity or the divine, it could be imagined that all people could in theory remain atheist agnostics all their lives. But this almost never happens; religion pervades all aspect of life to some degree be it historical, social, cultural, political or financial.

As I say, the term “atheism” ought not exist, but Sam Harris in his 2005 essay “An Atheist Manifesto” puts it much more succinctly than I ever could.

“It is worth noting that no one ever needs to identify himself as a non-astrologer or a non-alchemist. Consequently, we do not have words for people who deny the validity of these pseudo-disciplines. Likewise, atheism is a term that should not even exist. Atheism is nothing more than the noises reasonable people make when in the presence of religious dogma. The atheist is merely a person who believes that the 260 million Americans (87% of the population) who claim to never doubt the existence of God should be obliged to present evidence for his existence and, indeed, for his benevolence, given the relentless destruction of innocent human beings we witness in the world each day. Only the atheist appreciates just how uncanny our situation is: Most of us believe in a God that is every bit as specious as the gods of Mount Olympus; no person, whatever his or her qualifications, can seek public office in the United States without pretending to be certain that such a God exists; and much of what passes for public policy in our country conforms to religious taboos and superstitions appropriate to a medieval theocracy. Our circumstance is abject, indefensible and terrifying. It would be hilarious if the stakes were not so high.”

So often atheists align their godlessness with many issues that are caused or affected by religion and religious belief. This is simply not a hard and fast rule. Atheists, as in any walk of life, are people with many and varying viewpoints about the world. Walk into a room full of atheists and you will see different personalities, different passions, different aims, and different favourite causes. One thing that many atheists seem to hold in common is a distaste for anything they see as unjust, to varying degrees. I see this as an extension of the search for the answers to the big questions of life. The arrival at an answer of “there is no god” often comes from asking and denying what has been taught over a lifetime, and can be an incredibly painful process. Once the floodgates of questioning are opened and the answers point toward religion as the cause, so many other questions come to the fore. So it makes sense that so many atheists are active in not only trying to debunk the myths of religion, but human rights issues, animal rights issues, environmentalism, feminism, disability rights, reproductive rights etc.. The list goes on. In fact it may be safe to say that those who identify themselves as atheists also have an intolerance for misinformation, lies, superstitions and exaggerations.

It is quite apparent that atheism is becoming increasingly popular. We have established atheism as a valid stance in the world, not just a rebellious reaction or a trend; we have been heard by the churches and governments, the larger community knows we exist, and many people are throwing off the shackles and label of religion and faith away daily, in favour of a rationalist and naturalistic view of the universe. In this sense, atheism as a label has been very successful, with the aid of social media and the Internet. Our words spread far and wide, and here in Australia, we even have a female openly atheist prime minister. (Many would conjecture that whether or not Prime Minister Gillard believes in god is irrelevant since she panders to the vocal Christian minority with such abandon. But my point stands, not many other places on earth would have this.) The Australian media is quite open about stories of faith and godlessness, and I’d say, at least here, we have achieved the goal of bringing atheism up out of the dungeon, and making it seen as a position that good and real people hold, and is by-and-large not a position held only baby-eating rapist murderers who worship Satan. There is still a long way to go in other countries; in the USA I doubt we’ll see a female atheist prime minister any time soon, but the voices of the American atheist is being heard loud and clear by their churches and government.

The “shock and awe” campaign of atheism has left its mark, shocking the religious with our numbers, and leaving them in awe of our reasonableness and knowledge. They know we’re here and we aren’t going away. They also know we are gaining support, and the numbers of atheists, freethinkers and rationalists continue to swell. Atheist books are available in almost all bookshops, and in many the philosophy’s and religion sections are increasing in size and filling quickly with books by the irreligious. Atheist characters in television shows are increasing, and movies with atheist characters are also on the rise. I see this trend continuing, and it is only a matter of time before the truly religious are in the minority, and the rest of society either adopts “apatheist” (apathetic atheism) views, or openly atheist philosophical stances. This may be a pipe dream, but I have reasons for thinking this.

The enemy of faith is critical thinking and availability of good information. We are in an age where information is available in many digital forms, and almost anywhere too. We are discovering more about the human brain and body than at any time in history. We are seeing deeper into our universe, and deeper into cells than previously, and the rate at which we are learning is increasing also. According to the Flynn Effect, the average IQ on earth has had to be adjusted to accommodate an increase in intellect among all humans, and the average IQ (100) would have been considered genius only a century ago (approximately 130 by comparison). The exact causes for the increase is not clear, but it seems to me that with a rise in intelligence and in increase in availability of information, faith is eventually doomed.

It would be nice if we could move forward with some of the things that concern us about the world, rather than continually referring to whether a god exists when talking about our world and universe. In fact, better than nice, it would be great if we could stop referring to god at all. It is necessary to continue to hold on strong to our assertions that there is no god, or at at least that the claims of theists and their ideals hold no water, and that all signs point towards a new rationalist ideas. Given the sway that religious influence has on our lives in a destructive way, it is imperative that we continue to criticise the encroachment of religions into our secular lives.

Religion, however, is a powerful beast, and has many allies all over the world. In fact, once could say it is the single most powerful force in the world in terms of numbers, with 84% of people claiming belief in one kind of deity or another. Given the nature of religion, which is to attach itself to a person’s very identity, it is no wonder that the challenges atheists face are tough. And for some, the eventual arrival at an atheistic stance is one of the hardest decisions or realisations a person can come to face.

If we move forward as a global society, as I hope we do, we could in fact see major religions wane in power to a point that they become irrelevant to politics and culture. But in the meantime, we should not rest on our laurels, assuming that this growth in rational thinking will just happen naturally. It takes work, time and patience to make changes in the world. And it is by no means an easy task. In fact, it is draining to have to continually drone on and on about the question of god. I hope, before I eventually run out of steam and tire of talking about it, that I can make a difference to a person’s life on this philosophical playing field, and that they in turn can do the same for others. Remember, this is not about belief, this is about how belief and doctrines affect our cultural and political lives. With that as a focus, I hope to see a day when I no longer have to talk about these issues, and I can concentrate on the more important societal problems we face, such as violence against innocents, abuse against children, the environment and the ways we treat one another.

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120 Comments

  1. Martin S Pribble, your words have influenced me greatly over the past months and i value your decisive, clear reasoning, your ability to state the obvious, and your ways of inspiring thought to a higher plane. Thank you so much for your contributions to me and to those on the internet. I am reposting, eager to share with others. May I be so bold as to think my comments inspired you to communicate with me? I feel honored that you read and commented on my piece. 

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  2. I kind of agree that the term “Atheism” ought not to exist. The main reason it does is because atheists are the minority. Every minority needs to have a label in which to identify. Eventually, I hope, the term will no longer be needed.

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    •  @deityshmeity 
      Yes, I agree with you and Sam Harris, and think atheist is an unnecessary qualifier. However, given the vitriolic nature toward people who do not believe god exists, we are individually discovering what that means personally and culturally. There will come a time when we will not use atheist or African-American or Asian-American. We are all people on a planet going through space with a lot of other evolved creatures whose lives don’t last very long but who look at life as an incredible fact and feel grateful. 
       

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      • @JoanDenoo @deityshmeity

        What does vitriolic behavior have to do with scientific inquiry? Loose the Atheist chips on your shoulder and be a real Scientist. Does love exist, or does it not exist? How people act towards you has nothing to do with scientific discovery! Who are you? Why are you here? Where are you going to? You have nothing to navigate by, because it’s all relative to you being the center of the Universe, according to your Ego. Use your brain.

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        •  @AlbertJ  Vitriolic behavior? Are we reading the same post?

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        •  @AlbertJ  @JoanDenoo  @deityshmeity “Who are you?” I am I. “Why are you here?” To participate in life. “Where are you going to?” I shall dance in star dust, just as you. “You have nothing to navigate by,” I have stars, constellations, electromagnetism, forces of nature. “because it’s all relative to you being the center of the Universe,” I am not the center of the universe, I exist in the universe with all that implies. I am part of it all, I exist, not superior to or inferior to anybody or anything, we are all passengers on planet Earth and it is one wondrous ride. 

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        • @JoanDenoo @deityshmeity vitriolic is relative to the perspective.
          Joan has some nice words, sounds all philosophical and grandiose, but says nothing at all scientific.

          What is the purpose of life. Why dance at all, if this is just a big random accident? In a random Universe, Life has no meaning and suvival has no purpose.

          Everyone is dancing around as your Ego holds you by the nose, so you get dixzzy in relativism. Put down some absolute reference points to nsvigster by. Whst is the point of dasncing to s bunch of stars? No one yet can tell me who you are or where you are.

          how can you possibly go anywhere if you don’t know who you are and where you are?

          More importantly, why go snywhere if this is a piontless random Unoverse withn no meaning? Whis I am I? Where is I am I? It means nothing scientiofically.

          Can no one explain sceintifically who you are or wherew you are?

          PS, Diety, I can’t be vitriolic in a random accidental Universe. Emotions have no basis or reason to be in thast Universe.

          I did thst on purpose, because a real Atheist would not be bothered…by anything. What would there be to be bothered sbout in a random Universe? Nothing is repeatible of gauranteed, because there are no rules. It’s all random. Ergo, there is no such thing as atheists, becuae you all clumpo together, make your own anti-r3ligion Sunday schools, have your own mythology (poof, life just magically appered for no reason, even though there is zero scientific evidence this has , can, or will happen) and you even wrote your own anti-religion Bibel. What’s the matter. The vacuum getting to you. A bit to cold in there in your personal I am the center of the universe because when I die the lights wil go out Black holes? Anyone here in thios forum is not a real Atheist, you are just confused.

          The Laws of nature are not random And some higher intellegenc not only had to design them it has to msintasin snd srbitraste them.

          How long does if take for Man made laws to descend into chaos with no one to maintain and arbitrate them? Imagine how hard it is to get every sub atomic waveicle in line and conforming to the laws of nature!

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        • AlbertJ, might as well try to persuade us that no typo exists in your comment. Because any TRUE typo therein would result in whatever those sentences might mean in fact being nonsensical TO ITS AUTHOR.

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        • @blamer nice handle Blamer, so what, it’s not a random Universe now after all. Typos from iPad keyboards mean there is no trutyh in what is being commun icated now? heheheh, you made my point and my day! Coherency Rules, Atheists drool!

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    • @deityshmeity

      But why do you exist? why are you here? If everything is random chaos? What is the point? Unless there is some higher grand design?

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      •  @AlbertJ  @deityshmeity It is very egocentric and selfish to think we *must* have a higher purpose.

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        • @Dubravko @deityshmeity

          No, it is Egoistic to think you are the center of the Universe. And that all these Laws of nature don’t mean anything because it’s all Chaos. because your Ego, says so. WHen you place your self at the center of the universe, and ignore the gift of life with a meaning, that is the height of Egoism. You waste the gift to chase after…what exactly? If the lights go out when you die, why bother at all? isn’t that Egoism at it’s height then?

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        • Egoism is on display here. No one will use an ounce of intellectual honesty, because if you do, your Ego is done. Just like Kurt Russell in the Movie Vanilla Sky.

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        •  @AlbertJ  @Dubravko  @deityshmeity No one here except you thinks we are the center of the universe, Albert.  And I don’t believe anyone here has stated that the only state of being is one of chaos. Obviously, society plays a part in reducing the chaos.  
          You certainly don’t need a belief in a god or gods to appreciate life, either. Not sure where all this crap is coming from, except from a place of deep fear.
          Why are you afraid of atheism, Albert?

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        •  @AlbertJ  Ego may guide our biases and wishful thinking makes it compelling to believe as you do, but our preference doesn’t dictate reality. Until I have good reason to believe an all-powerful intellect is behind the universe, I won’t believe it.

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        • @deityshmeity How about Science as a reason? Which out an all powerful Intelligence, science it’s self, with it’s verifiable repeatability, can’t exist. Because all is random and chaos. yes?

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  3. “The enemy of faith is critical thinking and availability of good information.”

    True. The enemy of faith may also be humility (when confronted with the unknown or unknowable).

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    • @murraybiscuit

      Why does it have to be one or the other? Why can’t you use scientific discrimination to observe who you really are, why you are here and where you are going to. TO observe that you and Love are not separate from each other? And that the same force that give you the next breath also gives everyone else the same? and that this is what connects us all to the Universal Love (=God)?

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  4. So, children are born without believing in gravity and math, ergo humans are naturally anti-gravity ( a lighter air thought!) and anti-math (which explains the financial crisis today of course!)?

    If everything is one big happy accident, then there is no meaning to anything, so why do all you atheists whine about anything at all? And why do you care….about anything at all? Turn RD’s argument on it’s head and look in the mirror to see the LIGHT, the truth! If there was really such a thing as an Atheist, your natural state would be anti-whining and not to care…about anything. Atheists don’t really exist. What passes for Atheists is a bunch of confused folks in denial, because they are afraid of authority and rules, even while they worship the rules, the Laws of nature as observed utilizing scientific methodology. The very same methodology that should lead one to observe that the lights didn’t go out when Hitch-22 died. Hello! Stephen Hawking is not the center of the Universe, and the lights will not go out when he dies. He, as all Atheists, are observing the Universe from the wrong perspective, through the lens of the circular logical black hole that thinks one’s self is the center of the universe.

    Who are you?

    Why are you here?

    Where are you?

    Where are you going to?

    Until you scientifically answer these, you are the Blind leading the Blind, stuck in your personal black hole of consciousness, mistakenly thinking you are the center of the universe. There can’t possibly be 7 Billion centers of the universe, now can there?

    That’s a start. Your molecules replace each other every 100 days or so. You cells every 7 years. You can’t possibly be the body. You aren’t even the source of thoughts. If you were, like any transmitter, you could turn them off at will. So stop thinking now for 5 minutes. What’s that? Can’t do it? Hmmm, some scientists you all are. You don’t even know who or where you are, do you?

    You can not navigate from point A to point B, unless you know where and who point A is/are, now can you?

    “Hell is the delusion that somehow you and God are separate fro each other.” ~ Mother Teresa
    “God does not play dice with the Universe.” ~ Albert Einstein
    “If thine eyes be single, thy whole body shall be filled with light.” ~ Jesus

    There, you now have the secret of duality in the Uncertainty Principle. Light is always 100% dominant over darkness, so you you should understand the quantum physics underlying the Sermon on the Mount now (speaking of anti-gravity!). And so you should be able to navigate out of your personal black holes with ease, realizing that you personally are not the centers of the universe, even though the design of the 5 senses and inputs to the brain and it’s calculations make it seem so.

    Happy Cosmic Trekking fellow reflections of THE Light

    PS, Religion does not equal God. Stop trying to make it so. And God=Love. So says every saint and every spiritual scripture. Why would any sensible person want to deny the existence of Love? Because you observe it from your little self centered “I am the center of the Universe” perspective, you do not grasp the reason you are here, who you are and where you are going. Until you let go of your incorrect personal ID. Go back now and read the scientific definition of Hell. Was that a light bulb I saw turning on in there? heheheheh Welcome to the light, and remember light always defeats darkness!

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    •  @AlbertJ No one needs to “believe” in gravity or math, as both are easily proven- you can pretend that gravity doesn’t exist, but step out of a 2nd floor window and gravity will prove that it does indeed exist. 2+2 will always equal 4, no matter what your gods say.
      I really don’t understand the need of religionists like Albert above to assert so many strawmen to atheists- where did Martin or any other atheist state that we think we are the center of the universe?
      We’re not the source of our own thoughts because we can’t turn them off “at will” like a transmitter?
      Here’s a clue Albert, human beings aren’t transmitters that can be turned off and on at the flip of a switch. A transmitter is an inanimate object, controlled by electricity and that “magical” switch. 
      We are here because we evolved, just as millions of other species did. We are part and parcel of this ecosystem, no one put us here or gave us life.
      The god of your dreams may equal love to you, but all I see from religionists like you, Albert, is hate and intolerance. The sooner we rid the world of gods, the better off we will all be.

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      • @skohayes

        Real scientists use examples from nature and physics when examining the human. For example, when the study of human muscles didn’t have technology fast enough to measure the reactions, a plants that mimics the human muscles was utilized. Now, the entiric n

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        • The enteric nervous system is being used to study the brain. So, the study of transmitters fits with the brain also, from signal physics. Signals have an origin. So do thoughts. The origin of signals is a transmitter. The origin of thoughts is not your brain. because if it was, you could turn thoughts off, like a transmitter can turn off signals. there is something that mimics the brain though. Can you name it? Then you can find the origin of thoughts. What kind of ‘scientists are you all anyway?

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        •  @AlbertJ If scientists want to study the brain, they study the brain, Albert. Your brain is the source of your “transmissions” -a combination of chemicals and electrical impulses , and you can’t turn it off  because if the brain is not functioning, neither is anything else.

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        •  @AlbertJ “Your molecules replace each other every 100 days or so. You cells every 7 years. You can’t possibly be the body. You aren’t even the source of thoughts. ”
           
          it’s my understanding that certain cells (e.g. neurons and corneal endothelia) don’t undergo cell division. unless you have evidence to the contrary.

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    •  @AlbertJ “Scientific definition of Hell”?! Haha.

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      • @Dubravko

        Very ‘scientific’! …not

        Proffer up your scientific definition…if you are of such grand intellectual prowess? Or is it just drivel from you all? That’s the best you have? Seriously?

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        •  @AlbertJ  You said you gave us a ‘scientific definition for Hell’. You didn’t. There can be no scientific definition for an imaginary place. Even if there was, you didn’t provide us with one. That’s what my ‘haha’ was referring to. ;)

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        • @Dubravko

          WHy does Hell have to be ‘a place”? You are confusing people’s mis interpretations of reality with what Mother teresa is saying. When you separate your self from LOve, that is Hell. When you deny that Love exists, that is hell. heaven is not a place either. it is the opposite of hell, it is the reunion of one’s self with the Divine, aka Love. (Latin roots, Re-ligion, to rejoin one’s self with the Divine origins, your true identity).

          So far, no one can tell me who you really are, scientifically. So far, just a bunch of emotional drivel. Who are you, really? I showed you scientifically who you are not. You are clearly not the center of the universe, nor are you the body-mind. So…who are you?

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        •  @AlbertJ  Who ever said ‘I’ was the center of the universe? No scientist ever said something like that. Quite the opposite, actually. Who I am? I am a single member of Homo sapiens sapiens, a subspecies of an evolved animal, brought about by evolution by natural selection, composed of discarded star stuff, of particles created in the cosmic furnaces that we call stars, inhabiting a tiny little planet in one of the star systems in one of the galaxies in a vast, unimaginably vast universe. Who are you?

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        • @Dubravko Stephen Hawking said he as the center of the Universe when he said, “When I die the lights will go out”.l Pay attention, be a scientist. Didi the lights go out when Hitch-22 died? I just went over to the window to check, the moon is still on!

          You and Stephen don’t have to state it, your observational skills reveal it! Look in the mirror. You and all Atheists observe the Universe from the wrong perspective, as though you personally are the center of the Universe, and not a part of something larger. This is caused by the blind spot your Ego builds up to protect it’s psuedo-existence. The Ego doesn’t really exist.

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        • @Dubravko it is a matter of Physics, doesn’t get more ‘scientific’ than that. You and your fellow pseudo Atheists separate your selves from the whole, and thus mis identify who you are.

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        • @DubravkoYes I did, you just don’t know how to be a real scientist. Physics, specifically perspective. You mis identify your self as the center of the Universe. Point in case, you think when you die the lights will go out. News Flash, Hitch-22 died, and the lights didn’t go out!
          To live in the separation delusion is Hell. To understand Truth and live emersed in it is Heaven. Physics, perspective, scientific.
          Now be a scientist and explain where ‘you’ are right now! :) Biscuit still is lost, poor soul (that’s scientific Hell dude!)

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        • @Dubravko You say it with your body language. You observe through that deluded lens. You believe that the lights will go out when you die. That is only possible if YOU are the center of the Universe.
          And you mistakenly think you are the source of thoughts. If you were, yoiu, like any scientific transmitter observed in this COHERENT Cosmos, could turn off your thoughts. But you can stop thinking for even 30 seconds. because you are week and untrained. You let the 5 senses pull you around by the nose. You need to find the source of thoughts, the real transmitter.
          And you can’t possibly be the center of the Universe, because there can’t be 7 Billion centers of the Universe1
          So;
          1) Who are you?
          2)Where Are you?
          3) Why are you here?
          4) Where are you going to?
          Scientifically, unless you can answer those correctly, you literally are the Blind leading the Blind, all chasing your circular Logical tails.
          Which again, is the scientific definition of Hell.

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  5. Wow, must have hit a real nerve hey?

    So many fake Atheists here now.

    How about being real scientists. Where do your thoughts come from? twist and turn, you still can’t be the source of them based on scientific observations of transmitters, which ARE the origin of their transmissions.

    But really now, why are you all here anyway. Where do you care enough to reply?

    You lost this debate when you replied.

    Because a real Atheist has nothing to ‘care’ about. Caring and meaning even, have no context ina random Universe based on chaos.

    Why are you all whining so much? What is there to care about? You have no meaning, your life has no meaning, and you have no skin in the game of society. So why do you care so much.

    If as you believe there is nothing here but random chaos? Why were you born caring, about ‘stuff’?

    You don’t have to believe in math? Where is the end of Pi? You have to have faith there silly.

    What part of Infinity don’t you Atheists get anyway? And why wouldn’t you believe in Love. Who cares what people do to you, gravity and love still exists. You are being emotional, like some religious fundamentalist, LOL. Use your heads for something besides an ash tray and a cup holder.

    Love doesn’t need you to believe in it to exist. Any more than gravity. And both can be quantified and measured, even though we don’y fully understand either, nor can we see them. We see their affects. We measure them and we observe them.

    Waa waa whine whine, so religious person was mean to you. Does that mean Love does not exist? What a bunch of babies!

    What does that have to do with the scientific study, quantification and measurement of Love (= God).

    And instead of answering the questions who are you, why are you, where are you, you jump to the narcissistic Ego ID, where you see your selves as the center of the Universe.

    And is is this incorrect perspective, that makes great minds make childish and silly mistakes. like, “When I die, the lights will go out”. I presume you know who said that. Funny thing happened though, when Hitch-22 died, whoops…..the lights didn’t go out. I just looked out the window, big bright moon out there, yes sirieee! The lights are still on, LOL.

    “The observer affects the Observed.” – The Uncertainty Principle

    “Hell is the Delusion that somehow yo and God are separate from each other.” Whether you see and experience Love is up to your perspective, now isn’t it. You can see other’s actions as against you, or you can see tham as Divine instruction. Depending on whether you see yourself as the disconnected Ego, and hence the center of the Universe. Or, whether you understand that the Love with in you is connected to the Universal Love that animates all Life.

    Evolved? Sounds like a plan to me, LOL. and Plans have designers. Who made the rules, who maintains them day to day? I thought Chaos ruled? You mean to tell me not once in the last 14 Billion+ years, the Universe has collapsed into to chaos? Hah! Silly circular logical Egos, lost in your narcissistic black holes of consciousness. You mean to tell me you and Love are separate from one another?

    Have a little scientific intellectual honesty. Admit it. You lost the debate when you showed up here ‘caring’, about something. And atheists don’t really exist. because every one cares, about something.

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    •  @AlbertJ I can’t read this post, there’s so much straw flying around. Albert, you sound very confused and unsure about your own faith, and you come to this forum to project your insecurities on the atheists who post here.
      I suggest you spend some time reflecting on why it’s so important to you to put other people down to make yourself feel better about your own shortcomings.

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  6. Here it is folks, in black and white…really simple. Science is the proof of God.
    With out God to formulate the Universe, set it out with the laws of nature and maintain these laws, there could be no Science. Whoops. You need God to do these things for Science to be repeatable, quantifiable in different lab settings and verifiable. If the universe is Chaos and random dominate, then Science can’t exist.

    Chaos and randomness are subsets of Infinity and subservient to Coherency. The same as darkness is dominated by light, 100% of the time. Randomness and Chaos only exist to define coherency, in the subset if Infinity which is duality, the universe we are moving about in right now.

    How do we know coherency is dominant like light? Do an ideational experiment like Nils Bohr and Albert E did. Only this time, it’s Albert J saying God doesn’t play dice with the Universe. Because, if by some Abracadabra magic, life spontaneously appeared in a lab randomly,and then someone repeated the steps, and poof, life appears again……drum roll please…….it ceases to become …random, LOL.

    Don’t you love it when a Cosmic plan comes together! i do, come on, it’s funny. God invented the sense of humor for a reason. Smile. laugh. You are somebody now. You life has meaning and a purpose. Now go out and figure out what it is! Or not. God gave you free will. What would be the point of creating a bunch of puppets to bow down to you. But, if they can experience and understand the purpose of it all, and then love with out condition, what light! What infinite Joy! What infinite Bliss. Or not. Your choice. But you might want to consider putting your Ego shields down for a bit and see what it’s like? You can always jump back into your narcissistic Black holes if you want to.

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    •  @AlbertJ What if the universe just happened as physicists say, Albert? The laws of science exist without god, and theories like gravity and evolution exist with quantifiable proof without the need of an imaginary being to give them weight.
      Why would religionists call what they have “faith”? Because there is no proof of the existence of gods, and you need “faith” to believe in an imaginary being, just as children believe in Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny.
      God didn’t create man in his own image- man created gods in his thousands of years ago, to explain things that science explains these days.
      Your virgin daughter gets pregnant? A god turned into an angel and the immaculate conception was born (science knows that there’s no such thing). Big flood, millions die? God got mad at people and decided to kill them all (nice guy!). Cities crumble and burn in an earthquake? God the murderous strikes again. Human’s have always ascribed mean and petty tyrannical temperaments to gods, your chiristian god is certainly no different
       

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  7. if it is egotistic to believe that life has a purpose, then why are you born caring…about stuff? Like this column? If life has no meaning, where does caring fit in? Where does it come from? Why would humans ‘care’ about anything (which evidently all of you do) if life has no meaning? In a random chaos dominant Universe, care has no meaning. Meaning has no meaning. it’s all random. You all are mistakingly observing through the lens of coherency. It’s all chaos, remember? Yet you care….hmmmmmm? LOL Gattcha QED

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    •  @AlbertJ Albert, that’s easy- caring is a natural part of survival of the species. Even spiders care for their young once they hatch from the egg sac.
      And you seem to be avoiding all my replies and instead posting new comments to avoid them. Pretty obvious.

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      • @skohayes Sorry, I don’t have time right now to get to them all. But you are somebody, and your life does have meaning, even if i don’t specifically reply personally.

        No caring is born because life does have a purpose and meaning. Again, you are trying to fit into a Random and chaotic Universe through the lens of coherency, you are cheating. And you are the one that looses because you can’t see around your Ego. undo the coherency. There is now only random chaos. Now, there is no meaning, no reason to care, about anything. and no guarantees. FOr all you know, tomorrow the oxygen molecules will end up in a corner and you will suffocate. You are viewing the way you want the Universe to be, not like it really is.

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  8. Faith? You mean like faith in magic? That some how poof, life just appeared randomly, even though statistically it is virtually impossible and to date no scientific evidence supports life just randomly appearing from chaos? Like that faith you mean?

    Zap organic compounds with lot’s of electricity and what do you get? Not life, you get tar. perhaps that sheds some shadows on the dinosaur origin of hydrocarbons, but it does zero to support your faith in magic. And who maintains the laws and forces that make life both possible and continue. If this is a random chaotic Universe?

    It takes a lot of faith to believe in the magically that some how randomly creates DNA, a complex code with patterns and designs, and most of all…..drum roll please…..a PURPOSE! heheheh

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    •  @AlbertJ You, like many others of the religious sects around the world, are deliberately ignorant of science and therefore it appears magical to you.  It’s been like this since the beginning of civilization.
      Break out of that ignorance, Albert, and do some reading. Why are you so afraid?

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  9. So what are you saying there Biscuit? Even if there are (which there are not) a few cells in the body that don’t fully replace themselves, the molecules do. In which part of your physical body are you then? Which molecule of which cell is the permeant ‘you molecule”

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    •  @AlbertJlet me understand. neurons aren’t subject to the regular cell lifecycle, but the molecules are still replaced? how does this happen? from my understanding, the cells = the molecules (i’m talking about the cell structure here). please explain the mechanism whereby the molecules disintegrate and reintegrate from neuronal structure, without the cell undergoing apoptosis.
       
      even were neurons to undergo mitosis, the point is that the regular life-cycle of cells doesn’t impede organ function anywhere else in the body, so why should it impede the functioning of the brain? i don’t subscribe to a ‘pearl’ view of consciousness, but more of a Humean/bundle theory of embodied consciousness. theory of mind however, is really an awfully vague pursuit, which has little relevance here. if you’re suggesting descartian dualism, you’re going to have to contend with modern neuroscience.

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  10. Sorry, I do have to run for awhile, my life has a meaning and a purpose. And Love does exist, from my perspective.

    I’ll be back…LOL.

    In the meantime, to summarize, it’s been educational. I never met so manny trying so hard not to be somebody and trying so hard to deny the existence of Love(= God). It’s not me saying Love= God, it’s there for you to hear, and to read, then to discriminate scientifically and experience for your selves.

    I fully understand that some are just here as wall paper and artificial flowers, for texture along the way. But for those of you interested in breaking away from the cult of caring soooooo much about non-belief and non-faith that you have created belief and faith in it (see the irony, coherency always wins, just like light!), try a little self inquiry.

    I explained scientifically who you are not. Find out who you really are. Just because some mis informed religious folk were mean to you doesn’t mean Love doesn’t exist. By the way, Love can’t exist in a random and chaotic dominant Universe. it wold have no meaning. And there is no beauty in a random and chaotic dominant Universe. it would have no meaning.

    You all are like Plato’s cave dwellers, looking at the shadows on the cave walls and claiming that is reality. When I got you to turn around and look at the real illumination source, you were blinded by the light. Take a look again, and again.

    In the meantime, what part of Infinity don’t you understand?

    The Universe didn’t just come from Nothingness. it is the harmonically created subset of Infinity, of Everything-ness. And yes, gravity and relativity govern duality with the Uncertainty Principle. But outside that subset in Infinity. Only Divine Light and Divine Sound, governed by Divine Love. Friction between the two, Sound and Light, creates to Universe, governed by Divine Love.

    “If thine eyes be single, thy whole body shall be filled with light”. Reverse engineer back through singularity beyond gravity, beyond relativity, beyond boundaries and definitions, There is the ‘experience’ of heaven. The opposite is the experience of Hell, doubting the existence of Love, and meaning in your lives. Heaven can’t be a place, because places have boundaries. And you can’t be one with infinity and be housed by boundaries.

    Just because there are a lot of ignorant people with their attempts at belief out there, don’t get stuck in you Love-less, meaningless, purposeless Black Holes of personal space. Defeat your Ego, who is your jailer. Or not.

    You have free will.

    Quest on then. For those of you who are afraid of the Light, I wish you all the best in your momentary, experience of random, loveless, meaningless and purposeless existence! One which can never be verified by science, because science needs coherency to exist, just as does Love, meaning and purpose.

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  11. Biscuit, is there a “you’ that jumps around form cell to cell as every particle of the body is recycled every 7 years? Look how hard you struggle to keep your identity on your physical body. That is your jailer at work, your Ego.

    And here I thought everything was meaningless and random? Apparently you are really, really attached to your physical body. Some are really attached to cars, and houses, and so on. These, including the body are all transitory and all disappear with time. But, back to ‘you’.

    Where are ‘you’?

    I know this is new for you. because the cult of not caring and non-belief always starts in the middle and uses relativity to keep you dizzy. I’m giving you some permanent reference points from which to navigate by. WHile you still have possession of the 4D body-mind vehicle in which to move about and experience the true nature of reality.

    Start at the beginning.

    Who are you, where are you, why are you here, …..and then where are you going to?

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  12. Commenters here demonstrating that they cannot let what they read about godlessness (from the godless horse’s godless mouth) replace their treasured imaginings about the subject they’re being schooled on.
     
    The biggest hurdle of the atheist communicator is that definition. The definition that the unconvinced are hoping against hope is intellectually incomprehensible. Or internally inconsistent. Or doesn’t fit with the scientific/unscientific evidence. Or at the very least sounds more unbelievable than the fictions about god and goodness that they currently have in mind.

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    • @blamer commenters here are demonstrating they don’t understand the difference between coherency and Chaos/Randomness. Commenters here are demonstrating, they can’t use linear logic.
      Option 1), You die and the lights go out. Nothing matters, nothing mattered, nothing will matter. Meaning has no definition. All is just random chaos.
      Option 2) Coherency rules, chaos/randomness only exists as a subset within coherency-to define coherency, and your life HAD a purpose and meaning. Whoops?
      Either way, I win and you all loose. So, why are you trying sooooooo hard not to have a purpose, or a life with meaning?

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      • @AlbertJ  It’s of no consequence whether you can comprehend of a grey area between your 2 options, the godless don’t buy your false dilemma. To us our lives have as much purpose and meaning as yours.
         
        Nothing you’re saying is tempting folks here to think any differently. Certainly your superior coherence and logic isn’t able to convince us that our lives are inferior to yours. Even if we’re mistaken about some historical facts about this world and its smart apes.

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      • @AlbertJ  You are using this objective definition of meaning like there is only one.  I give my life meaning and purpose by doing what I enjoy as often as possible.
         
        When I die I won’t have the meaning you are talking about but it will have a positive or negative impact on those around me, that has meaning to real tangible people.  If I just go around messing with people, like you enjoy doing,  then my impact is as negative as yours. If I have a positive impact on people then even when the lights go out it did matter.  Don’t confuse your life by only looking at the destination and rather look at the journey, you will find it has more meaning than you obviously think it does.
         
        Life is not some big evil trial to get to the finish line in tact for some shitty reward of licking your god’s boots for eternity like it says in revelations whether it be real or not.  If I found out there was a god, any god, I would simply look it in the face and say WTF.

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  13. I’ve often thought it silly to call myself an atheist, but sometimes being forced to use the term as a convenient shorthand, despite the mistaken baggage it carries in the popular culture. But any shorthand requires some explanation, and when it’s derived from reason I tolerate being obligated to well, provide reasons for it. That doesn’t always clear things up when the listener refuses to listen, but sometimes progress in understanding is made, and that’s satisfactory. Thanks for posting this Martin… Excellent!

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  14. Just for fun, go over to the New Scientist web site or buy this weeks copy dedicated to “What id reality”.

    Isn’t that really what the debate is about here? So, what is reality.

    Reality is that which never changes, that which is absolute. Everything else is an illusion, and chasing after the illusions and delusions is like chasing rainbows, literally. The physics is the same.

    The root cause of the rainbow chasing, is observing the Universe as though you personally are the center of the Universe, which we all agree, is not possible. Yet you all still insist on observing that way. It is caused secondarily by the design of the 5 sensory inputs into the brain, and how the brain computes those inputs. To make the movie of life at a framing rate of 5 microseconds, the brain needs time. the movie seems to be reality, but physics tells us there is nothing rally there, except maybe some vibrating strings of energy. The delusion of thinking you are separate from ‘things” is accomplished by stereoscopically creating duality, which is influenced by our perspective and focus.

    “The Observer affects the observed”

    Check out the Princeton University Millennium project. Random number generators are made coherent during massive human focus, like the Millennium celebration, the O J trial and 9/11. In fact, they, in hindsight, predicted 9/11 12 hours before it happened. Which shows, that consciousness is governed by Relativity, the same as light and so on. And this project is like Eddington’s solar eclipse proof of light being relative.

    As your perspective and your Identification of who you are and where you are shifts from the illusion that the lights will go out when you die, to reality, the newtonian, the electromagnetic, the chrono quantum and sonic quantum realms can then be controlled by your focus. Or in mass as the bell curve of society evolves above the relativism level you all are stuck in. I’ll exxxxplain more in deatil about levels when i get a chance.

    You all think this debate is happening on one level.

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  15. Atheists are basically stuck in tow levels, one dimensional fundamentalism, and two dimensional relativism. You think of it as a horizontal chess board, I think of it as a 4D chess set with multiple layers of chess boards and communication going up and down between levels.

    Right now most of you are stuck in two dimensional Flatland, and you are arguing about Religion with one dimensional fundamentalists, and three dimensional common sensors (those who can see this is not a random Universe, scientifically nits impossible for life to happen and continue in a random Universe). Yet you have no concept of the third dimension, because you are stuck in Relativism Flat land. Because you observe the Universe like you are the center of it.

    I am here to help you up into the third level, and then beyond. Because all the levels are still illusions and subsets of reality, which is absolute and never changing. It has to be, by definition!

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  16. Let’s use simple linear logic to see which path is more beneficial, regardless of who is right and who is wrong in this debate. If you take some deep breaths and cleans your brain stress hormones, you will see there is really only one logical and scientific path. The other is just emotional and Egotistical. Self centered and narcissistic.

    First a couple of observations. Your life span, when graphed next to the age of the Universe, doesn’t even exist when we round off, which science does quite a lot.

    There is no reason for compassion, life, fun, joy, fulfillment or purpose in a random dominant Universe, by definition.

    But, let’s say you Atheists are right. You live with no hope, no purpose to life, no meaning, you die, and the lights go out (not true per earlier proof, I looked out side and the moon is still on, but let’s say it’s true anyway). I live my life full of hope, meaning, purpose, some joy and so on. Then I die and the lights go out. Poof, that’s it. Nothing matters in either case, but I had a better time while I was here because of my delusion of hope and purpose.

    Second path.

    Suppose I’m right. Life has a purpose besides eating, sleeping chasing sensory in puts and dancing to the stars. You waste the gift of life, never take the time to ask who you really are, where you are, why you are here and where you are supposed to be going to. You spent your life your creator and ll those who worshiped the creator, Now you spend your last breath both in awe (per Steve jobs last words) and begging for another chance. Please, this time I promise I’ll get it right.

    Not me, I made the effort, I used scientific discrimination and faith combined, I opened my mind and heart to the possibility. I realized if it was true , all the answers were already embedded with in me. I was provided with a teacher and pathway that made sense to my personal make up.And I transcended the boundaries of the body and the mind to experience the true nature of myself and of reality.

    Recap. Case 1, nobody wins, but my time here is richer and less full of existential depression. Why do you all even get out of bed in the morning, what’s the point of your random chaos anyway?

    Case 2, I win, you lose.

    case 1, nothing to win or lose, case 2, you loose it all.

    That;s what we call literally a NO brainer. because as soon as you let your Ego build up your mind into something it’s not, you loose. It’s very simple, but the hardest decision you will ever make.

    Got Will power? What part of Infinity don’t you Atheists understand? Follow the Lights out gang, or turn on the light. Because light always defeats darkness (ignorance). I can’t loose, I choose light. But you all stand to loose everything, in your personal black holes.

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  17. Great post Martin!  I have been reading your blog for about a year now and l always enjoy the clarity in your writing.  
    I agree that the tide is turning and the religious may one day be the minority. Society is very secular now and things are swinging our way.  You and Dawkins are right about children.  The thing is though, it is human nature to want some kind of meaning. I think we learned that facts, knowledge and science alone won’t end superstition and religion. I forgot which scientist it was in the 19th century that said most of U.S. or world population would be atheist in our time because of scientific advancement. This has not shown true and Michael Shermer has spoke quite often on this subject.  Now, most free thinkers, atheists, non-believers whatever you want to call us, have spent a significant amount of time figuring out what is true and in the end we are content with the truth of reality because we have no choice. We embrace the beauty of simplicity to complexity. We realize we create our own meaning and it’s all on you!  There is no alternative.  Also, atheist/non believers (the word does need to be retired) are just as happy and sad as believers and actually handle death better or the same as believers. 
     
    I think for a huge crowd of the religious, they need something emotional to replace their superstition and science just won’t do it for them.  Perhaps first try to slowly get them to embrace Deism? I don’t have the answer but it’s a difficult long road changing from a believer into a naturalist like you said.  I grew up Catholic but I have always been intellectually curious with a high need to know why things are they way they are, so you no where that road lead to.  It’s a gradual process that sneaks up on you.  
     
    The only hope I can think of for the religious is Transhumanism/Singularitarianism.  It has offered an optimistic view for the future of humanity. I also like Allen Tough’s two articles on Meaning.  I do admit, some part of me really hopes we are living in a Nick Bostrom simulation where they have an afterlife ready for us in another sim.  
     
    Gaining Meaning and Purpose from Seven Aspects of Reality (© 1986, Portable Document Format)
    From Which Aspects of Reality Can We Gain Meaning and Purpose? 
     
    And this Albert guy is not even coherent and very sophomoric.  He did not seem to comprehend anything you said. 
     
     
     
     
     

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    • @CarsonMcKnight What is there to understand in a universe that is random governed by chaos? Your Egos are all cheating, trying to invent a Universe that appears by random magic, from the lens of coherency! Go back to randomness. Now, how do you get to coherency, with no Intelligence to recognize it with? it’s impossible.
      More importantly, why do you even care? once you take your last breath, nothing you did matters. According to you.
      What part of Infinity don’t you Pseudo atheists understand? You aren’t real Atheists, because you all care…about something. Atheists by definition should not care about anything.

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    • @CarsonMcKnight explain how you get meaning and purpose from Chaos and randomness. That is just intellectual dishonesty. Today it’s corn, tomorrow it’s a bicycle. That is your random universe, which only exists in your convoluted minds. In 41= billion years, corn has not randomly turned into a bicycle. Why not?

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  18. “We can forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of Life is when men are afraid of the Light!” ~ Plato

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    • @AlbertJ Albert that statement is not about GOD it’s about KNOWLEDGE. You are shooting yourself in the foot by using it. Don’t make me ban you again.

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  19. So science is THE proof God is. Bam! Slam! No typos needed in this coherent dominant Universe, hey? If you took a bunch of monkeys on typewriters, typing random letters, it would take more monkeys than there are atoms in the known Universe to type a coherent sentence. The rub is, there would be no Intelligence in a random Universe governed by Chaos to RECOGNIZE it was a coherent sentence, so it would not matter. LOL

    I’t impossible for darkness to beat the Light. It’s impossible for Chaos and randomness to have come first. Silly Egos! Climb out of your black holes and stop arguing with one dimensionals about Fundamentalism and three dimensionals about the Universe beyond your two deimensional Flatland, and look around. All three are delusions. Reality is absolute and unchanging. Changes is illusion and delusion.

    What part of Infinity don’t you Atheists understand?

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    •  @AlbertJ You don’t seem to understand what science is, Albert. How can a very broad field of study be “proof that God is”?  What proof, other than your undying declarations, exists? 
      What do monkeys have to do with anything? Put a bunch of human infants or a bunch of rocks in a room with typewriters and you’d get the same result- nothing. What does that prove? You see, scientists propose hypotheses, and then look for proof that the hypotheses are true.
      You have said that god exists, so how will you go about proving it to us?
      People like you claimed the sun revolved around the earth  two thousand years ago and when scientists took measurements and proved that it was actually the other way around, the religionists burned them at the stake.
      You claim that it is impossible for darkness to beat light, yet even with billions of stars in our galaxy, space is dark and empty. Impossible for randomness and chaos to exist, yet one only has to look at a nebula where new stars are born or a black hole where they go to die to see that is not true.
      You’re flailing around, throwing words and phrases out that have no meaning. No coherence, one could say.
       

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      • @skohayes You over think it because of the shadow cast by your Ego driven intellect.
        Explain to us all, oh enlightened one, how science works in a random Universe dominated and governed by Chaos?
        First comes coherency. Randomness and Chaos only come about secondarily, to define Coherency. I gave you several scientific proofs, like the Princeton Millennium project.
        Science has to have a coherent Universe, and can’t exist in one governed by chaos.
        Otherwise, to day I measure Oxygen, but tomorrow the same measurement turns up a banana. :) In your version of thew random Cosmos. With no Intelligence providing for the Laws of Nature. Or more importantly, maintaining those COHERENT laws for 14+ billion years. Coherency rules, your chaos drools!

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      • @skohayes Why do we need coherency> I thought, Poof, by magic, from random chaos it all came?
        Abbrakadabra…

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      • @skohayes WHat is the scientific method? It needs repeatability, something impossible in your random Universe governed by Chaos. Science needs rules. Rules don’t appear by magic/ Monkeys or what ever typing random letters don’t make a novel. it is mathematically impossible. SO, with out Intelligence to write the rules that Science lives by, there can be no Science. But hey, what did Albert Einstein know anyway, right?

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  20. ” I am not interested in the make up of this or that molecule, or the spectrum of this or that element, I want to know how God created this world. I want to know HIS thoughts, the rest are just details.” – Albert Einstein

    “Everything should be as simple as it is, but not simpler.” – Albert Einstein

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  21. Truth, Reality, is unchanging, absolute and eternally constant.

    That which changes is Illusion.

    The illusion is perpetuated by the delusion that one’s self is the Center of the Universe (when I die the lights will go out).

    Science it’s self is Proof of God. Science can’t exist with out God to create, maintain and arbitrate the laws that allow for science. Science has no context or definition in a random Universe governed by chaos. Neither does the word/concept of “governed”.

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  22. Let’s make this the “Science needs God to exist (or not” post. Cone one, come all, explain to us with your Ego driven intellects how science and the scientific methos work in a random Universe governed by chaos. Please show us o grand intellects. we await the words of random wisdom. Oh wait, random and wisdon can’t belong in the same universe, now can they?

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    • @AlbertJ Albert, the universe, the earth, the sun, all existed before your sky fairy did. Billions of planets, suns, galaxies, billions of years in existence, and you think someone invented by humans that has only been around 6000 years (other deities have been around longer than yours, by the way, but that doesn’t make them any more real) created us?
      LOL.
      Keep writing new posts and ignoring the replies. I’m sure Martin is enjoying the added traffic to his site.

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      • @skohayes Who said anything about 6000 years? I said in 14 Billion + years, the Universe has never collapsed into Chaos? Keeo up silly. Your childish attemps at humor don’t equate to being much of a scientist, now do they?
        Sky ferry? There you go seperating your self from the whole, as though you personally are the center of the Universe. No wonder you can’t tell us who your are, where you are or why you were here. The stars and suns and planets? They all conform to the Laws of Nature. What Intellegnce created thos laws, maintians those laws for 14 Billion + years and arbitrates them daily?
        WHat part of Infinity don’t you attheists get.
        And why do you care? About this post, about anything? When nothing matters in a Random Universe governed by Chaos? Why do you get out of bed each day? For what, when you have no meaning, menaing has nho meaning?

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  23. Maybe this will help you flatlanders understand the scientific mistake you are making observing the Cosmos detached from it as though you personally are the center of the Universe.
    2012 October 7 – The Same Color Illusion
    http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap121007.html

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  24. is Skohas and his sky ferry the best you all have for Science is the Proof that God is? How sad then. With silly illogic like that you strive to be meaningless and pointless? Now you understand how powerful your Egos are, what powerful pull your desires and attractions have, and how you form your own personal Black Hole of circular logical intellect.
    Nobody move of the Sheriff get’s it!, says the sherrif in Blazing Saddles. That is you all. More scientifically, you are the Algorithm Mr. Smith in The Third Matrix, shouting as loud as you can, so as not to let the Truth in, “everything that has a beginning, has to have an ending, …until you disappear, LOL!
    Ever consider the sacred spiral of Pi, the one used to design some important parts of the human body?

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  25. Poor biscuit still can’t even find himself. Let’s see now, which Neuron or molecule or string waveicle is “biscuit” in now? Where in the whirl is biscuit? LOL

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  26. As far as I can tell, I answered all your posts. Sorry, I have a day job. But why do any of you care, if this is a random Universe where nothing matters? When you take your last breath the lights go out, yes? So nothing y0u do matters at all. Especially if you map that against the 14+ coherent years we can observe the Cosmos has been here, and round off your life span, as science tends to do, since it doesn’t really have the capability to quantify or measure Infinity, by simple definition of Infinity.
    Let me know if I forgot any of you please.
    In the meantime, what part of Infinity is it that you Atheists don’t get?

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  27. It hasn’t all been a waste, in spite of your fear inspired Intellectual dishonesty.
    I observed a new Uncertainty pair. Caring and non-caring. Which is dominant, like light and darkness? Can’ you tell?
    Like Coherency dominates (and thus came before) Chaos and randomness, Caring dominates non-caring.
    Because, as I observe your Egos in denial and hiding from the light, the more you all try to ‘not-care’, the more you care1 Brilliant!
    Real Atheists don’t care. What is there to care about in a Universe with no meaning? Meaning can only be derived from Coherency.
    Q. E. D.

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  28. One of the problems with this blog is the ‘reply’ doesn’t always come back to the post. I suppose that is because it’s inside a random Universe. :)
    Skohayes said…AlbertJ You, like many others of the religious sects around the world, are deliberately ignorant of science and therefore it appears magical to you. It’s been like this since the beginning of civilization.
    Break out of that ignorance, Albert, and do some reading. Why are you so afraid?
    Why do you all insist on projecting your fears on the messenger? Hmmm?
    science needs coherency to govern the Universe, or it could not exist. I can’t believe I have to explain this simple fact to such high and mighty intellects!
    So why in the world would I be afraid of Science? Science is the Proof of God, for heaven’s sake! You confuse me with your confused Sunday school fundamentalists, silly. I am Truth. I am merged in it. I am the light. So are you all.
    There is one subtle difference between us and god, but it is important to the whole conversation.
    The Ocean can exist with out the wave, the wave can not exist with out the ocean. yet they are one. You and I, we are quantized Consciousness on the infinite ocean of Divine consciousness
    Explain scientifically now;
    1) How coherence cam fro Chaos/randomness
    2) How that coherency is maintained 14+ Billion years with out a break down or gap
    3) How the coherency laws are arbitrated minute by minute (if this Universe if governed by Chaos and Chaos came first)?
    Afaird of the science now are you? WHat part of Infinity don’t yo0u Atheists get? Just keep repeating, “Everything that has a beginning, has to have an ending”…over and over, until you disappear, like Mr. Smith in the 3rd Matrix. Just don’t be too scientific and study Pi now, 3.1416………

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  29. Dubravko said
    @AlbertJ @deityshmeity It is very egocentric and selfish to think we *must* have a higher purpose.
    Don’t project your selfish, self centered I am the center of the Universe on Me. I’m not the one who thinks the lights will go out when I die, in spite of the fact the lights are still on, and Hitch-22 died.
    What is really egotistical is to observe the coherency of the Universe daily, minute by minute, and then dismiss it because you are afraid of rules and authority. What is arrogant is to think life has no meaning, and then pretend to care about things, yet have to intellectual dishonesty to ignore the ramifications of society, when you teach children they are pointless, meaningless accidents1 THAt is Egoism my friends! And the height of hypocrisy. Either be an atheist and go hide under a rock and cower until your last breath, or admit you care, due to coherency.
    Stop hitting out at the messenger, and defend your beliefs. What, that’s right, Atheists can’t have ‘beliefs’, because why would they, in a random chaotic governed Universe?

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  30. Dubravko said
    @AlbertJ Who ever said ‘I’ was the center of the universe? No scientist ever said something like that. Quite the opposite, actually. Who I am? I am a single member of Homo sapiens sapiens, a subspecies of an evolved animal, brought about by evolution by natural selection, composed of discarded star stuff, of particles created in the cosmic furnaces that we call stars, inhabiting a tiny little planet in one of the star systems in one of the galaxies in a vast, unimaginably vast universe. Who are you?
    I am, the same as you a quantized parcel of Divine Consciousness. Unlike you, I don’t separate myself in the delusion that the life force that gives me the next breath is some how different than the life force that give you the next breath.
    Evolution sounds like a plan. What Intelligence wrote the plan? What Intelligence maintains the plan for over 14 Billion years with out one single collapse into chaos?
    How exactly do you randomly jump from gases and star dust to life again? and the scientific proof of that exists whee now? Talk about faith! Zero evidence in the entire field of Science, every, anywhere, yet you all believe this mythology about random magic making life?

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  31. skohayes said
    @AlbertJ If scientists want to study the brain, they study the brain, Albert. Your brain is the source of your “transmissions” -a combination of chemicals and electrical impulses , and you can’t turn it off because if the brain is not functioning, neither is anything else.
    Do you all see now how the ego clouds you with blind spots? Nothing scientific in this post addresses the scientific observation, “if you personally are the source of your thoughts, why can’t you turn them off at will, like any scientifically observed transmitter can?”
    Lot’s attacks on the messenger, but no substance. why are you all afraid of the science, and of the truth, and the light?
    Give me some signal processing physics where the transmission can’t be stopped at will by shutting down the source transmitter?
    If you pay attention, you will see, from science, what you really ae. And it’s not a tought source transmitter. Ergo, you personally are not the source of thoughts. Simple physics.
    And by the way, neuro-biologists don’t have fast enough technology yet to study the brain. So they study with the existing technology the slower Enteric nervous system and use it for an analogue for the brain.
    you do understand basic scientific methodology don’t you?

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  32. . @AlbertJ Albert, while I’m quite happy for you to continue your circular reasoning rants here on my blog, can you please keep 2 things in mind? 1. Be respectful to other commenters or you will be banned from posting. 2. You have posted 16 comments in an hour and a half. Try to have some restraint and don’t flood the comments or you will be banned from posting.
     
    Restraint and respect. Also, maybe try to structure your arguments better. All I see is baseless blind assertions, conflation of unrelated topics, and terrible, terrible grammar and spelling.
     
    Personally I’m not going to address the “facts” you bring up, because to tell you the truth I have no idea what you are on about, except that we (atheists) are “wrong” and you are “right”.

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  33. Maybe I’m assuming too much here, i thought this was some advanced think tank. My mistake.
    Sceince needs repeatability, something which by definition does NOT exist in a random chaotic Universe.
    If I randomly produce life in a lab, then repeat that process in another lab to scientifically validate it, it ceases to become “random’> Whoops!
    When massive human focus happens on the same event at the same time due to current events, random number generators become….drum roll please, coherent!
    “the observer affects the Observed.”~ The Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle, proven not only by the famous double slot experiment, but now also bt the Princeton University Millennium project.
    Do I still project fear of Science here. or are you all projecting your own fear of Science not fitting your random chaotic Universe?
    Brin on the science! Science is the best proof of Gd, Divine Intelligence, which is nothing more (or less) than Infinity.
    Do you still want to say God (= Love, = Infinity) does not exist, when every bit of science proves Love and Infinity exist?
    You all are trying really hard not to mean anything, and to be worthless and pointless! :)
    But you ‘care’, and so you loose, over and over again.

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    • @AlbertJ 17 posts

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  34. w Skohayes, you really “CARE” don’t you? Why, if this is a random chaotic Universe. Real Atheists can’t get their feelings hurt like you. Man up and be a real Atheist. And give me some real science while you are at it.
    skohayes said
    @AlbertJ I can’t read this post, there’s so much straw flying around. Albert, you sound very confused and unsure about your own faith, and you come to this forum to project your insecurities on the atheists who post here.
    I suggest you spend some time reflecting on why it’s so important to you to put other people down to make yourself feel better about your own shortcomings.

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    • @AlbertJ  18 posts…

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  35. Skohayes, do I have to draw you a picture? I thought I was among fellow scientist? You, by your body language, put your self int eh center of the universe, when you (by your faith) believe the lights will go out when you die. It’s physics and perspective. Get a piece of paper and draw it out. Again, Hitch-22 died and the lights did NOT go out. Ergo your faith and belief scientifically is wrong. As is your observation of the Cosmos. You are like Plato’s cave dwellers thinking the shadows on the wall are reality.
    s said
    @AlbertJ @Dubravko @deityshmeity No one here except you thinks we are the center of the universe, Albert

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    • @AlbertJ  @Dubravko  @deityshmeity  19 posts. LAST CHANCE ALBERT!!!

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      • @martinspribble @Dubravko @deityshmeity t addressing all the complaints I haven’t answered the posts, and your blog is acting too random, it doesn’t go to the post, so i have to cut and paste into another post. But of course, there has to be a format like WordPress, designed by a higher Intelligence, before the appearance of randomness ‘appears”. All yours now, I’m done for the night. Hope there is some scientists out there with real answers.
        As for respect,k where does that come from in a random Universe governed by Chaos? :)

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  36. Skohayes, read my lips. Pay attention! Where did I ever say God was ‘a being’, or a sky fairy? That’s you all projecting Fundamentalism on me.
    I clearly said Go=Love, God = infinity. You clearly have no scientific arguments, so you try to put words in my mouth, which I never, ever said. LOL
    es said
    @AlbertJ What if the universe just happened as physicists say, Albert? The laws of science exist without god, and theories like gravity and evolution exist with quantifiable proof without the need of an imaginary being to give them weight

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    • @AlbertJ  OKAY ALBERT I’VE WARNED YOU. You are no longer allowed to post here. Please find another place to peddle your wares. Maybe consider getting a blog of your own rather than trolling mine.
       
      Consider yourself banned from posting until further notice.

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  37. I’m just here to watch Albert J get kicked.  *popcorn*

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    • @D4M10N Well there it is in black and white

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  38. Skohayes, of course it’s obvious, whoo hoo! Why do you think I brought caring up in the first place.
    Now why is there caring. Not just ‘it is, we don’y want to question why, because it blows up our random Universe”. Why.
    If this is a random universe governed by Chaos, there is no reason for caring. or survival. Or meaning. Nothing is repeatable because of chaos and randomness, so Science doesn’t exist.
    You observe but you don’t SEE. Spiders and fish care because the Universe if not born from Random Chaos. Be a scientist.
    It’s not ‘pretty obvious’. it’s really, really obvious. LOL
    skohayes said
    @AlbertJ Albert, that’s easy- caring is a natural part of survival of the species. Even spiders care for their young once they hatch from the egg sac.
    And you seem to be avoiding all my replies and instead posting new comments to avoid them. Pretty obvious.

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  39. Finally something coherent and well stated! Now just ad a sprinkle of scientific and intellectual honesty.
    It is impossible for Science to exist in a Universe governed by random chaos. it is impossible to start with chaos and go to coherency (because you first need the Intellect to recognize coherency). Just as Light defeats darkness always, coherency defeats chaos. and Caring defeats non-caring.
    God = Love = Infinity
    If you still want to say Love and Infinity don’t exist, I’m afraid all the sceince in the Universe can’t help you.
    deityshmeity said
    @AlbertJ Ego may guide our biases and wishful thinking makes it compelling to believe as you do, but our preference doesn’t dictate reality. Until I have good reason to believe an all-powerful intellect is behind the universe, I won’t believe it.

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  40. Skohayes, actually 2+2 in alternate mathematical dimensions does not equal 4 always. in REM dream state, time is a different velocity than in your newtonian waking state. Neither exists as you think of them in deep sleep.
    God is just as much a scientific phenomenon as Gravity. We can’t exactly explain either. we can measure, quantify and perform repeatable scientific experiments verify both gravity and God = Love = Infinity.
    skohayes said
    @AlbertJ No one needs to “believe” in gravity or math, as both are easily proven- you can pretend that gravity doesn’t exist, but step out of a 2nd floor window and gravity will prove that it does indeed exist. 2+2 will always equal 4..

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  41. You kinda lost me at this. “The answer should be, for every right-minded reasonable person ‘No, I cannot prove or disprove the existence of God’. ” I take offense to that, because it IS possible to disprove the existence of a god that is properly defined. A vague Deepak Chopra kinda god is hard to dispel, but the more vague the definition is, the less valid, and the more defined, the easier to prove impossible. 
     
    I concur that agnosticism and atheism answer different questions, but we can’t just dismiss both questions. We have to answer both questions. An agnostic is someone who thinks that question cannot be answered. I’ve already proven it can. 
     
    The Abrahamic deity described in Jewish, Christian, and Islamic teachings is about as likely as Harry Potter, Darth Vader, or The Gingerbread Man. It’s a fictional character. It is the anthropomorphism of that which was unknown to the writers of the dogma at the time. Application of the scientific method, comparative scrutiny to other objective historical evidence, and even a fundamental understanding of how human beings think and lie and manipulate each other leads to the rational and obvious conclusion. Religion is a delusion fostered by ignorance which is perpetuated unknowingly by some and intentionally by others. 
     
    The Abrahamic god does not exist. Maybe there’s something out there that created the universe. If it happened to be everything the human written dogma claimed it was, that still wouldn’t prove anything. Those who made up this dogma had no way of knowing they were right. They were not magically given this information by an omniscient deity cuz an omniscient deity would not have used ignorant goat herders thousands of years ago to make his case. 
     
    The odds that is so, are so mathematically remote as to be easily dismissed. The far more likely scenario, is that people were scared and they made up a god so they would feel better about not being able to understand or control the universe in which they lived. 
     
    There is no Abrahamic god. This is not a belief. It’s a conclusion after following the evidence. 
     
    If something like a god did exist, we’d have to invent a new word for it, to differentiate it from what people believe exists, just as we can’t call a goat or horse with a single horn a unicorn, if we ever found one. Cuz it wouldn’t be the magical creature from myth. It’d be something like that but different, and we’d have to acknowledge both the similarities and the differences. 
     
    So there can be no god. Whether you believe this or not, it is so. Whether or not you follow the evidence to its conclusion, the answer is the same. You can put your fingers in your ears and go la la la all you want. That doesn’t change the truth. 
     
    Another truth is that religion will continue to exist in humanity for a very long time. It’s a very powerful force in human culture and society, and it’s not going to go away despite the evidence to the contrary, because there is that sliver of a chance that if you believe in a god there is one, and an even slimmer chance that the god in question just happens to fit every detail you’ve imagined it to be. You are far more likely to win the lottery a dozen times in your lifespan. People love to bet against the odds. That still doesn’t change the truth.

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    • @ZachsMind Very compelling.
       
      “They were not magically given this information by an omniscient deity cuz an omniscient deity would not have used ignorant goat herders thousands of years ago to make his case.”
       
      To the layman I think the odds of deism –if they’ve ever learnt about it– must sound exceedingly similar to the odds of a creator that performed subsequent historical miracles. That is, involving prophets, surviving texts & moralizing institutions (imbued with good teachings, as monotheism keeps insisting on).
       
      The “good” teaching of their Genesis 1:1-3 fiction seems to be that biblical miracles are –even if unbelievable and incredible– strictly historical.
       
      From there it’s hardly a stretch to imagine that miracle-maker character –even if 14.6B years old– to be still around and inspiring a few famous historical figures, essentially yesterday.

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    • @ZachsMind I have done nothing BUT scientifically prove the scientific phenmomenon of God. God is proven by inference from science. Scicnce can’t exist in a random Universe governed by magic. The scicntific methodology involves repeatibility and verifyability. With out a higher intellegence to maintain the laws of nature for 14 + Billion years, the Universe would have collapsed by now into the chaos and randomness you claim spawned the universe. Or is 14 Billion years not long enough for you? There is no, as in zero, scientific proof that something comes from nothing, that life can spontaneously just appear, or that stars can spontaneously appear. You need something to get something. and you need life to begat life. and you need stars exploding to get new stars. Whoops!

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  42. Afterlife exists says top brain surgeon – Telegraph
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/9597345/Afterlife-exists-says-top-brain-surgeon.html

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  43. How to navigate out of relativitavism and the circular logical black hole caused by placing one’s self at the center of the Universe.
    Turn on the light. Light always defeats darkness 100% of the time.
    2012 October 10 – Nauset Light Star Trails
    http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap121010.html

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  44. Humans differentiate from all other species in that we alone have the Divine gift of realizing we are all interconnected to the source. Only in human form, can we understand the true nature of reality and our personal identification with it. If we can see around the ‘little me’ shadow produced by the Ego, and exaggerated by Intellectual Elitism. Which creates a self perpetuating shadow chasing black hole that crates the illusion of superiority and the delusion of separation from Oneness and Singularity.
    What part of Infinity is it that Atheists don’t understand?
    Were social networks humanity’s edge over Neandertals?
    http://blog.chron.com/sciguy/2012/10/were-social-networks-humanitys-edge-over-neandertals/

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  45. What would there be to ‘remember’ in a Universe dominated by random chaos? A ‘memory’ would be useless in such a Universe.
    http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2012/10/121008-brainless-slime-goo-spatial-memory-robot-slime-science-reid/
    Is even the slime in the ice machine of higher intellegence than those who insisit on denying the science, the facts in front of them? Of course the scientific method is not possible in a Universe dominated by random chaos either.

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  46. orry Blamer, can’t find you post, don’t have time to look for it. Funny this blog acts so random, after starting out coherent first. I don’t see myself as superior to even the ant, you do apparently. I see myself as the life force that animates you, me and all of life. I am one with it.
    Your life has no meaning in a random universe, because the randomness dictates it. You are lost in a circular logical philisophical black hole. Use physics. Random by definition can not allow ‘meaning’.
    I didn’t design the Cosmos, I’m observing it as it is. SO, I can’t help it iof ilight always defeats darkness, and if coherency always defeats randomness. What this means in terms of science, is that before there was randomness, there was always coherency. Meaning God of course.
    You have free will. That’s all you have. You have the free will to run around with that chip on your shoulder (and the handle blamer fit’s that perfectly) and BLAME the universe for all your problems, hiding from reality. Or you have the free will to see life’s obsticales as opportunities to grow, and to understand who you really are, and the true nature of reality. “I finally figured out the Universe was not out to get me!” ` Phillip K. Dick

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  47. Aploogis to Nic-and also, can’t find your post. as tangent, for a bunch of people rulled by random chaos and magic, there sure is a lot of fundamentalist “Thou shalt not do this or that….” here :) Anyway, be scientists and get away from hiding from the facts. Come out into the light just for a minute. You all can run back into your caves if the light hurts your eyes. Scicnce, physics, randomness, chaos. There is no meaning to ‘pourpose’ in a random Universe. and there is no meaning. That is the whole point. There would be no point to needing to make up meaning in your lives if there was such a thing as real Atheists. You can’t have that vacuum in your lives. If this was a Universe governed by chaos and randomness, you would have no problem with a meaningless pointless life! Now, as a scicntist, ask your selves why your Egos try so hard to convence you that you have meaning in a random Universe, where tomorrow you could wake up a mouse? It’s a random Universe, right? No ryhm or reason to it. So what is there to care about? Why in the world would Richard DSawkins have a charity. Howq pointless for a REaL Atheist. You are all just prentending to be Atheists here patting each other on your exitential backs. Be scientists now, use physics, and explain to everyone where how purpose and meaning exisit in randomness. The argument is obvious, first there was randomness, then came coherency, and so now we presto by magic have meaning. Except, I already took that arguement away with physics. Coherency came first, just like light. Because the defeat always, thier Uncertainty twins. Checkmate.

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  48. Meanwhile, over at New Scientist : Forget quantum physics, forget relativity. Inklings of an ultimate theory might emerge from an unexpected place – find out where in this week’s cover story.
    Notice it is the theory of everyTHING, not NOthing. Stars come from other stars not NOthing. Babies come from other humans, not NOthing or from corn. Life comes from other life. The Universe come from EveryTHINGness not NOthingness. Albert was right, and Nils Bohr was wrong, there needs to be, accoding to the Uncertainty Principle of physics, an original ‘Observer’ to start these chain reaction off in the beginning. According to overwhelming scientific evidence. Where is your science showing starts magically appear from No thing? Or life? Show us please!

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  49. On markets and the impossibility of socialism
    http://bigchieftablets.wordpress.com/2012/10/16/on-markets-and-the-impossibility-of-socialism/
    This applies to all theories, not just economics, from science to religion. If you start off with a false premise, you can make anything appear true.
    Need a Universe with Life? Skip over the part where it get’s formed and start in the middle. Come up with a simplistic theory on how things gradually progressed by mutations, and people will buy it. Not only will they buy it, they will only look for facts to reinforce it after awhile. All based on the foundation that by magic, something comes from nothing, even though there is zreo scientific evidnce that this can happen in all of the 14 Billion+ years the Cosmos has been around. Not to mention the statistical impossibility of it, or the many blaring holes in the theory (300 genes separate a human and a mouse, the Canbrian Explosion, complex human parts like cellular pumps that need all the parts at once to work, so it’s imp[ossible for them to have ‘evolved one part at a time…to mention just a hand full). And things need otherthing to perpetuate. Stars are born from other stars exploding. They don’t just appear by magic. Life comes from other life. It doesn’t just magically appear. Only by adding God back into the equation, does any of it make sense. otherwise, How else can the Universe be not only still expanding, but also accelerating at the same time? Defying the standard model of physics.

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    • @AlbertJ Albert. I banned you from commenting, but you didn’t notice. You just kept on posting. So here’s the deal. I’m going to let you post whatever you like here. But I will not stand up for you if someone here decides to take you to task for your beliefs and strange interpretations of life, science and the universe.

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    • @AlbertJ Someone isn’t taking his tablets. Tut-tut.

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  50. AlbertJ has been unbanned, but only so you could see what he’s writing and facepalm along with me. @AlbertJ please, you conflate so many unrelated things to suit your notion of a god that it’s embarrassing. seriously, yours is the ultimate conspiracy theory, and you’re starting to sound like a certain Canadian psychopath I know…

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    • @martinspribble bring it on Oh great one! Where is your science? Got any science?
      Got science to get you from nothing to something? Any scicnce to get you from something to the laws of nature? Any scicnce to get you from the laws of nature to Stars with out intellegence and focused energy to start the chain reaction? How about some science then, to get you from inanimate to life? Got any scicnce to back that up oh Great one?
      Because if you did, you would have the Martin Nobel prize….isn’t that the real Truth? Tell your students the Truth now.
      Or are you just going to stand there in front of your students and embarras yourself with silly name calling? Got any sciecne Martin? If so, let’s see it. 1) Who are you? 2) Where are you? So far, just the blind leading the blind in a black hole of Egoistic circular logic, unable to break free from relativism.

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  51. This is exactly what I mean by placing yourselves at the center of the universe. Let’s forget science when it’s convenient for your Ego.
    Science says in a Universe of random chaos, there is no meaning or purpose (by definition). If I have to explain logic and physics to you, then you really are hopeless (and it’s chaos out there by golly, don’t you see? The moon has switched places with the sun for heaven’s sake.)
    Messing with people’s lives? You mean by using science and facts to give people meaning and purpose? Or is it messing with children to tell them their lives are pointless and meaningless because the universe is dominantly Random Chaos? And fooling them into believing that they personally are the center of the universe? WTF Chaos? Oh, right, chaos doesn’t know what WTF is, because it can’t possibly recognize it.
    Of course God can. God = Love. If you want to continue to say WTF to Love, well you have free will, and you get what you deserve. But God still continues to rain down Divine Love on you anyway. The sun still shines, the lights have not gone out for 14+ Billion years. The Laws of nature continue day in and day out to be coherent, for 14+ Billion years, in spite of what you claim. You can’t just wave a magic wand and get rid of gravity, or Love. Even when you say WTF to Love. :)
    And you can’t wave a magic wand and give yourself meaning in a random chaotic Universe. In order to have meaning, you have to first have a purpose. Otherwise, it’s just wishful thinking based on blind faith in magic. What is the point of leaving a better world when in a random chaotic Universe it can turn into a snow cone tomorrow.try coming into the light for awhile, i promise it will not hurt you. I was once where you are, thinking I personally was the center of the universe. I had an even bigger chip on my shoulder then. I prefer the peace that surpasses definition, the scientific affirmation of knowing, when I gain control of my mind, and make is cease, in order to experience the true nature of unchanging reality. Instead of chasing change and rainbows as shadows on the Cave walls of your Ego. But hey, that’s just me. Meaning, or purposeless nothingness. Mr. Smith-everything with a beginning has to have an ending, or Neo, like Pi, infinite. The choice for me is literally a no-brainer. Students of jesus described the ‘knowing’ of personally experiencing the truth as ‘dying daily in the lord’ in the Bible. You can’t have the experience of knowing beyond the hardware and software limitations of your body-mind, because you allow the mind to control you, instead of controlling your minds. You can’t even stop thinking for a simple 30 seconds, much less hours or days.
    Has Biscuit figured out which neuron his in ‘in’ yet? Nope? Any one have something besides emotions shown below here, any actual science? Science to get you from nothing to something? Science to get you from something to the laws of nature? Science to get you from gases to stars? Science to get you from stars to single cellular life? Science to get you from single cellular life to humans? No? I thought so. Otherwise, you would have a Nobel prize by now.
    Can anyone explain why the Universe is both expanding and accelerating at the same time, defying the standard model of Physics? No? Man, I thought Scicnce had all the answers! Well, at least science proves by it’s own existence that God is. Science can’t possibly be in a random chaotic universe.
    NakkiNyan said
    @AlbertJ You are using this objective definition of meaning like there is only one. I give my life meaning and purpose by doing what I enjoy as often as possible.

    When I die I won’t have the meaning you are talking about …

    Life is not some big evil trial to get to the finish line in tact for some shitty reward of licking your god’s boots for eternity like it says in revelations whether it be real or not. If I found out there was a god, any god, I would simply look it in the face and say WTF.
    “Everything should be as simple as it is, but not simpler.” – Albert Einstein

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  52. I see you are having problems with your posts Martin, must be that random Chaos! So here the first answer: @martinspribble bring it on Oh great one! Where is your science? Got any science?
    Got science to get you from nothing to something? Any scicnce to get you from something to the laws of nature? Any scicnce to get you from the laws of nature to Stars with out intellegence and focused energy to start the chain reaction? How about some science then, to get you from inanimate to life? Got any scicnce to back that up oh Great one?
    Because if you did, you would have the Martin Nobel prize….isn’t that the real Truth? Tell your students the Truth now.
    Or are you just going to stand there in front of your students and embarras yourself with silly name calling? Got any sciecne Martin? If so, let’s see it. 1) Who are you? 2) Where are you? So far, just the blind leading the blind in a black hole of Egoistic circular logic, unable to break free from relativism.

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  53. I see you are having problems with your posts Martin, must be that random Chaos! So here the first answer:

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  54. @skohayes WHat is the scientific method? It needs repeatability, something impossible in your random Universe governed by Chaos. Science needs rules. Rules don’t appear by magic/ Monkeys or what ever typing random letters don’t make a novel. it is mathematically impossible. SO, with out Intelligence to write the rules that Science lives by, there can be no Science. But hey, what did Albert Einstein know anyway, right?

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  55. well, I never expected to meet such scientific cowards here, interesting. Also interesting, is how Martin has created an Anti-Bible Sunday school with all the fundamentalist rules,, while I’m the one who is free. LOL

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  56. well, I never expected to meet such scientific cowards here, interesting. Also interesting, is how Martin has created an Anti-Bible Sunday school with all the fundamentalist rules,, while I’m the one who is free. LOL1000 places of Pi
    Here is the expansion of arranged in groups of 50 digits as Aitken recited it.
    3.14159265358979323846264338327950288419716939937510
    58209749445923078164062862089986280348253421170679
    82148086513282306647093844609550582231725359408128
    48111745028410270193852110555964462294895493038196
    44288109756659334461284756482337867831652712019091
    45648566923460348610454326648213393607260249141273
    72458700660631558817488152092096282925409171536436
    78925903600113305305488204665213841469519415116094
    33057270365759591953092186117381932611793105118548
    07446237996274956735188575272489122793818301194912
    98336733624406566430860213949463952247371907021798
    60943702770539217176293176752384674818467669405132
    00056812714526356082778577134275778960917363717872
    14684409012249534301465495853710507922796892589235
    42019956112129021960864034418159813629774771309960
    51870721134999999837297804995105973173281609631859
    50244594553469083026425223082533446850352619311881
    71010003137838752886587533208381420617177669147303
    59825349042875546873115956286388235378759375195778
    18577805321712268066130019278766111959092164201989
    Go Back
    JOC/EFR May 1997

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  57. @skohayes WHat is the scientific method? It needs repeatability, something impossible in your random Universe governed by Chaos. Science needs rules. Rules don’t appear by magic? 2.
    systematic knowledge of the physical or material world gained through observation and experimentation.
    In other words, coherency is necessary for science. And Coherency comes from a higher Intelligence. Ergo, Science proves God is, because science has no meaning in a random universe governed by chaos. QED

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  58. 1 John 4:8 Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love. God = Love. Love is a scientific phenomenon just like gravity. It can be quantified, studied, measured and those measurements are repeatible (which scicntifically can not be repeated in a random chaotic Universe),
    God = Love is found in every spiritual scripture of every major Religion. If you all want to keep denying Love, and keep saying Love does not exist, you get your wishes. You have free will. You only find my observations about God streange because they are True, and Turth will set you free from the bondage of rainbow chasing after chaos and randomness in a coherent Universe. Anyone out there now want to deny the existence of Love (=God)? You have free will still.

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  59. What, no real science? Well, at least for a bunch of two dimensional Flatlanders you did get one thing correct. The language of God is Silence. Drawing you a picture now, as you are either a bunch of Jr. High kids who haven’t learned a lot about Science and philosophy yet, or you’ve taken way too many drugs, and brain parities are a big problem for you.
    So, I’ll take it a bit slower for you. God = Love = Infinity. Per all the major scriptures of all the major religions. Following so far? I don’t want to loose you now. Silence then, is the only language, which can encompass Infinity, boundary-less. Thus, you see many Saints taking vows of…..Silence, because the best way to learn a language is immersion.
    What part of Infinity don’t you Atheists understand?

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  60. Suppose I were to reply to you gravity huggers that I wanted to take the dictionary definition I wanted, not the base line reference point of Science for gravity? You make the point that gravity is Science, and I say you just don’t understand the ‘gravity’ of the situation, and so on, dance, dance, dance. I dance around your logic in circular fashion, all the while protecting my world view of gravity, because I’m the center of the Universe, and I can’t be wrong. Because if I’m wrong, then then my world view is gone, and another reality will be taking it’s place. And that would be scary, if I believed that new world view was out to get me. As you all clearly have been brainwashed into believing. (Love?, who would have thought you all would be so afraid of Love!)
    This is all of you, trying to choose your own definition of ‘meaning’ out of a dictionary, instead of acknowledging that scientifically, there can be no such thing as purpose, meaning, or a point to anything (including you and your life) in a random chaotic Universe. I am surprised I have to explain the core of Existentialism to you all, it’s very Cosmically Ironic! I love it. You don’t even understand your own philosophy.
    Drawing a picture for you again. Random, Chaos, no repeatability, no Science can be valid, nothing can be counted upon, there are no rules. No point to anything. And hence nothing has any meaning, at all. Least of all you or your lives. Even if you tell yourselves you have meaning. Come on now, Man & Cowgirl up. If you want to be Existentialists, fine. But you then have no meaning, no purpose. You just ‘are’, for no particular reason, rhyme or point. My point is that none of you can live there, it’s not natural, because this is NOT a random chaotic Universe, and it has been coherent for over 14 Billion years. So your real question now is, how long are going to keep pretending this is a random chaotic Universe when clearly it is not? Another 14 Billion years?
    “Everything should be as simple as it is, but not simpler.” – Albert Einstein
    ~ Identical fermions never collide. ~

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  61. @AlbertJ OKAY ALBERT. This is my FINAL WORD on your posts. I gave you the benefit of the doubt in that you may actually be trying to prove something here. Turns out you are nothing but a delusional spammer. You have posted 71 comments on this piece, and are yet to make a point. Because of this, I am BANNING YOU PERMANENTLY for commenting at my blog. Goodbye.

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    • @martinspribble  @AlbertJ Probably not a bad idea. I pictured an endless thread with Albert J posting blather day after day.

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